This is a lightly edited transcript of the January edition of Right Now With Perry Bacon. You can watch the video here or by following this show on YouTube or Substack.

Perry Bacon: I’m the host, Perry Bacon. I’m honored to be joined by one of the guests we’ve been trying to book from the moment we started doing this show in August. A great politician, a great leader. I always look forward to hearing what she has to say. So Senator Warren, welcome. Thanks for joining us.

Elizabeth Warren: Thank you. It’s good to be with you.

Bacon: I want to start—you gave a big speech yesterday about the Democratic Party, about where you want it to go, and you used two terms that I want to define and talk about. The first was, you used the phrase “big tent.” You defined big tent in a [particular] way; you want to see the party [as a] big tent, and you defined it in a way where you were wary of a certain kind of big tent.

So tell people who didn’t see the speech about your two views of a big tent, and what kind of big tent you want to see for the party.

Warren: OK, so remember that the underlying thread of this whole speech is about how we win and about the importance of talking about where families are economically right now. The economic pressure that families are under.

So the question is: What does a big tent look like? And there are folks within the Democratic Party who think that the big tent means that we put together our economic plans and proposals with a very careful eye on the billionaires and other wealthy donors.

So yeah, we talk about how it’s tough for working families, but we put up proposals that nibble around the edges, that are modest, that are simpatico to keeping the rich rich and everybody else struggling. In other words, replicating a rigged system.

The alternative vision of the big tent is that we say, full-throatedly, We understand the problem. The problem is a rigged system that keeps flowing more money to the top and less money to everybody else. We have concrete plans to fix it, and here they are. And here comes the best part: We’re damn well willing to get in there and fight for them, and we’re willing to fight for them even if it offends other Democrats and Democratic donors.

Those are two very different visions of the big tent, and my view is: When the choice is between billionaires and everybody else, we win when we choose everybody else.

Bacon: In other words, Elon Musk can join the big tent if he wants to pay taxes at a higher rate and not destroy the government, but the tent is not going to be open to him for us to do what he wants.

Warren: Let me say what you’re saying, only slightly differently. [The] big tent is open. We’re just not going to change our message for somebody who says, Oh, but I could open my wallet and offer you millions of dollars—nope.

Our message is the right message for us, and we are committed to get in there and fight for it.

Bacon: The other term you used was “abundance.” And again, you gave—there’s a positive view of abundance and a view of abundance you want to avoid.

So talk about—unpack that term and why it can be useful, but can obscure bad policies........

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